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Old 09-16-2010, 12:43 PM   #1
Hawaii
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Overpriced maintenance?

My mom took her car to BIMMERSPORT two weeks ago. We were unhappy with the service (whole other story that I'm going to avoid this time) and now that we're realizing that we potentially got ripped off, we're even more disappointed.

My mom paid $525 for a Cam Shaft sensor install (including parts). On our invoice it states that labour was 2.5 hours. As I understand it, the cam shaft sensor install does not take 2.5 hours. To be sure we called a BMW dealership and were told by them that it takes "About 1 hour." Fine, Bimmersport is not a BMW dealership, but charging us more than DOUBLE the amount of time that the dealer charges (which is always longer than it takes to ACTUALLY do the job) is pretty much criminal. At least this is how I feel.

Maybe someone can chime in and help explain to me how this job took 2.5 hours and why our part costs were MORE expensive than BMW dealership prices.
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Old 09-16-2010, 06:40 PM   #2
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Tell me what car, and i will tell you how much labour it calls for.
for 02 m3
intake cam sensor 2.4 hrs labour
exaust cam sensor .5 hrs labour

Info taken from Snap-On Shopkey
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Old 09-17-2010, 11:53 AM   #3
Jon@Bimmersport
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Hawaii,

I'm sorry to hear you are still having issues with our service.

Like I stated, the car brought to us mid-day and was requested (and heavily stressed) that the car needs to be picked up today. Like stated in your previous thread your car was not booked in for an appointment, where as we work by appointment.

We told your mom to drop it off because of the fact she was unhappy at another shop and your sister used to bring her 325i cab to us which we did help her out with so since you guys did not believe the other diagnosis, we would give you a second opinion.

Secondly, I know what the dealer charges for this job (.6). We charged you the time it took to do the job while it is hot as you were not able to leave the car here overnight and for the rest of work requested. Note: I did not quote her at .6, I knew it would take longer to do so given the working conditions. I dont care if the dealer charges .6 when you leave your car for the day, these allowances were not given by the customer. I quoted your mom and she agreed to the price. I doubt and know for a fact, you CANNOT walk into a dealer..leave your car half day, get all the diagnosis and get the job done right away in "about an hour" or even 2 if its hot. NO tech would do it. As to why I did it? Well it from what your mother said you are unsatisfied with the other private shops you have been to (I am guessing except for the shop who's license plate frame you have on) so I'm doing my best to do everything that was requested and give the car back as scheduled. ON TOP OF IT ALL, if you read the invoice...the labour is 2.5h correct, but we did not charge you 2.5H to just do the cam sensor. We checked your suspension, we checked the brakes, we put the wheels on the balancing machine to see how much they are off balance. I even possibly fixed your E39 alarm issue when we closed shop at N/C to save your family money and stayed on my own time to explain in GREAT detail any concern your mom had - mind you, we do not do work for free..our time and knowledge is our income.

If you want to make a post, to see what was fair...scan the invoice or better yet I can upload it via PDF with your permission...however, in all fairness (since this is about being fair) there is 2 sides to a story. The total invoice of $525 was for our:

Diagnosis
Cam sensor
Labour:
Cam sensor and putting the car up on the hoist to check all these items plus put the wheels on a balancing machine to see how severe the bent wheel is

Checking the vehicle to see what is required - As requested from the customer (not a quick look over like with an oil change)

FR wheel bent
Front rotor + pad
Rear rotor + pad
Rear left lower control arm
Rear spring x2
Front sway bar link x2
Rear lower ball joint x2
Rear trailing arm bushing x2
Flex disc
Alignment

Summary:
You went to another shop and feel you were quoted for work not needed and they did not diagnose what you asked. - Unhappy customer, Shop name undisclosed

Customer calls Bimmersport, explains their desperate need for it to come same day and be done same day as they drive over 100km to get to work and is tight on time and cannot be without the vehicle

Customer asked Bimmersport to diagnosis the CEL, and check over the vehicle as there is many issues (vibration, brakes etc). They were quoted an excess of $1500 to replace vanos solenoids and camshaft sensor, possibly the unit off the top of my head. In other words, they were not offered to TRY the sensor first as it may cause all those faults to occur as a byproduct from the faulty sensor.

Customer only approved our recommendation to change the sensor FIRST and drive it as it can save you money that other shops tried to get out of you to cover their diagnosis (basically).

When I followed up with the customer the next day for a quote for the work (as they wanted a cheaper price - very hard to do given the extent of work your M3 needs that has built up over neglected maintenance) she did not indicate that the code or problem came back.

In my opinion, if you performed the work they recommended then you would be out over a $1000 for a problem that didn't need all that work. You are complaining how we ripped you off, but we quoted you less and gave you and option and honest opinion to potentially save you unnecessary repairs (and from my understanding on BOTH your cars it did). Why replace the vanos if its not needed?

I saved you money compared to the other shops who told you to change pretty much the vanos system, I helped you on the E39 alarm (and like I said we do not do free diagnosis) and you are telling me that it is unfair to charge you 2.5h to check all that stuff on your M3 and do the cam sensor on a 100degree motor? Im sorry but there is many other jobs I have here...there is ongoing swaps and FI applications that I cant spend (and lose) time for something that may not even return for the work needed (as Im not the first one to tell you all these problems). I stayed on my own time (no this is not invoiced or part of it as I stayed after you paid) to explain things to your mother than clearly you can. If you have a problem with us, the other west end shops in Mississauga/Oakville as well...why do you bring it from shop to shop? It seems as all of us are trying to rip you off. I don't understand given the extent I went for your mother, why you are complaining about paying us to do what was requested. At this point, Its unclear what your motive is here to me as you are stating I charged you 2.5h to install the cam sensor.

At least I had the respect not to insult your mother how she was when she was at other shops you visited, if you cant afford to fix it..or want to shop around - your choice...but don't get disappointed if I have to charge for time I'm spending for you.

You can give freebies and make your money back later, but when you are not sure if you will have a call from the customer to bring it back for the work on the free diagnosis..I lost time, and it doesn't make sense for a business to lose time when there is other jobs that can be done.
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Last edited by Jon@Bimmersport; 09-17-2010 at 12:16 PM.
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Old 09-17-2010, 12:55 PM   #4
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LOL, completely agree with above post.
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Yo man, I got $6000 in my bank account, and I could buy any car i want
Ya man with $6000 in the bank, you're really balling arnt ya
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Old 09-17-2010, 01:33 PM   #5
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Jon I want to reinforce my car but I dont want to pay for it. Make it happen....

in all seriousness can you PM a quote with parts and labour. Thanks.
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Old 09-17-2010, 04:49 PM   #6
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Old 11-10-2010, 04:57 PM   #7
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Jonny had a very fair and detialed thought out response telling us what happened. I would like to hear why the op made it sound like he was charged 2.5 hours for just a sensor install when CLEARLY there was more done here???
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Old 11-10-2010, 10:09 PM   #8
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cant argue with the explanation. i work at mazda and we have a couple of people that cant be pleased no matter what. we bend over backwards and still get undeserved backlash. we had one customer complain to the point of wanting to send a letter to mazda canada because they said that there should be an engine cover compleatly covering the motor under the hood. you lift up the hood and see a humongous cover from fender to fender, cowl to hood latch. like i said cant please everybody no matter how much you try
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Old 11-10-2010, 11:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blk3 View Post
cant argue with the explanation. i work at mazda and we have a couple of people that cant be pleased no matter what. we bend over backwards and still get undeserved backlash. we had one customer complain to the point of wanting to send a letter to mazda canada because they said that there should be an engine cover compleatly covering the motor under the hood. you lift up the hood and see a humongous cover from fender to fender, cowl to hood latch. like i said cant please everybody no matter how much you try
ROFL...a preson like that should not even open the hood, i dont know WTF are they doing there anyways, i doubt they even check oil...
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Old 11-10-2010, 11:15 PM   #10
blk3
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Originally Posted by Eurostyle View Post
ROFL...a preson like that should not even open the hood, i dont know WTF are they doing there anyways, i doubt they even check oil...
you like that one? we also had a customer complain about a detail because every single speaker hole was not q tipped. and yes the car was very clean. they did it twice and she still wasnt happy. they just gave her the money back and she still complained.
or the woman who came back two weeks after her car came in for service saying she cant find her prada sunglasses so we must have stole them. yes because us guys like to wear womans sunglasses. if you are going to complain about that show up the same day or a day later. not two weeks after.
lol the theme her seems to be the ladies. haha
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Old 11-11-2010, 09:16 PM   #11
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I say post the scanned copy without their personal information and the truth will be told. I'm sure the OP ignored all the extras that was performed and only zeroed in on the cost (must be Finance person)
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:30 AM   #12
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I say post the scanned copy without their personal information and the truth will be told. I'm sure the OP ignored all the extras that was performed and only zeroed in on the cost (must be Finance person)
I have PM'd the OP, no response or even to the thread. If the fire is died down, I don't feel the need to re-fuel it. Although I am still curious to know if they're hood switch was the cause of their alarm.

Thanks for the concern.

BLK3, you remind me of my days at Mississauga Honda.
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